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Interviewer: Larry E. Rivers
Interviewed Mr. Arnett T. Goins at Florida ASM University Black Archives Research Center and Museum on September 24, 1993.

Larry Rivers Brief Introduction: Mr. Arnett T. Goins, my name is Larry E. Rivers and I thank you for allowing me time to interview you concerning Rosewood.

Larry Rivers: Mr. Goins, tell me a little about yourself and your family.
Arnett Goins I was born in Rosewood in around 1915. I was, I think about seven or eight years old. My father was George Goins and he has been dead a long time now. My mother was Willie Retha Carrier Goins. My grandparents were Sara Carrier and Haywood Carrier. My father was a logger who worked in the woods.

Larry Rivers: Please tell me something about Rosewood that you can remember as a child.
Arnett Goins There was a big turpentine still there.

Larry Rivers: Please tell me about the Goin Turpentine Industry?
Arnett Goins Now, I don't know whether that it was obviously it was operating, but I can't remember whether it was operating, but he had one then, well I understood he had one then, because I don't remember my grandaddy on my daddy's side, but he had a turpentine still.

Larry Rivers: So that would be your grandaddy on your daddy's side? (His name was Ed Goins)
Arnett Goins Yes, because he come from turpentine country. He come from North Carolina.

Larry Rivers: You may not remember that, but tell me something about the other businesses that were in Rosewood, I mean was there some kind of Black Store, what did the people do for a livelihood?
Arnett Goins A lot of people worked 3 miles away that was Sumner, that was all right there together, a big saw mill was there, a lot of people worked there and a lot of people worked at Wylly that was 1 mile from Rosewood and had a turpentine still. People dipped-gum or one thing or another. I ain't never knew if my uncle dip-gum he use to hunt and kill birds, quails, and stuff.

Larry Rivers: What did the women in Rosewood do, for example: did they do laundry for people, did they sell food from their gardens at a local market or depot or did they basically stay around the house and raise the children?
Arnett Goins They didn't stay around the house. My grandmother, she used to work to Sumner. She used to work for the lady in the house at Sumner. She use to go and do the washing and ironing, and sometimes me and my youngest brother her youngest son was 13 months older than me, than I were, and we use to go with her sometimes and just rack wood, the man that had the mill had the wood use to come down. We use to rack wood while grandmama do the washing and ironing.

Larry Rivers: Who's house did she work in, in terms of doing the laundry?
Arnett Goins Her name was Taylor, I don't know her first name, but her name waz.

Larry Rivers: Fannie Taylor?
Arnett Goins Fannie Taylor - right, she had two little boys.

Larry Rivers: So, what could you remember about Fannie Taylor, could you just give me a ball park figure of what you thought her age might have been in thinking about it over time, what do you think her age was at the time your grandmother was doing the laundry, was she a young lady?
Arnett Goins She was certainly young, cause she had 2 young boys, 2 little boys.

Larry Rivers: So she was a relatively young lady! What did Fannie Taylor's husband do?
Arnett Goins He was something, I don't know what he did but he was something at that mill. He worked at the mill. I don't know whether he was a foreman or what not. But he worked at that mill, cause he use to have that wood hauled from the mill, what me and my youngest uncle use to go down there and rack it, go with grandmama to work and be right there with her.

Larry Rivers: Now, would you say Rosewood in 1923 consisted mostly of all Blacks?
Arnett Goins Most of it was Black, I wouldn't say it was all Black.

Larry Rivers: I have read reports where they said forty percent of Rosewood residents were white. For example, 4 residents out of 10 were white.
Arnett Goins I don't believe that, it was that many whites, I couldn't say, but I don't believe it was that many.

Larry Rivers: I understand Mr. Wright owned a store there. Were there any general stores or little stores you could buy things from?
Arnett Goins Now I heard, I can't remember that but Mr. Wright had a store. Now we use to go down there and get stuff, he was a pretty decent fellow, he was a guy that let us, me and my uncle was there, grandmama would send us to get something, cause we always got our grocery from Jacksonville. They had to order it by the hundred pound sacks and things. Like little odd things, she use to send us up there, we would go up there and get it, and we get it, we'd start out the store and he would never use to let us go out that store unless he give me and my uncle, I call him my brother, he would give us some candy or cookies or something to eat on the way back home.

Larry Rivers: I meant to ask you earlier, how many brothers and sisters do you have?
Arnett Goins I had 2 brothers and 2 sisters, it was 5 of us.

Larry Rivers: Where did you fit in terms of ages? Were you in the middle, the oldest?
Arnett Goins I was next to the oldest, my sister was older than I was, and I was next to her. Then it was a boy next to me that died when he was a baby. Then, I had another brother next to him, then a baby sister, she's still living, me and my baby sister are the only kids still living.

Larry Rivers: Before 1923, What did you all do for fun? .You hear children today going to dances and dancing, or you hear some playing football, some playing baseball, some playing basketball. what did you all do, because I think back then, I might have had a hard time finding something to do that was considered fun?
Arnett Goins We played just like all the grandchildren. We would get out there, we call it the hard ground, we play ball and mostly now you take Minnie Lee's grandparents, Minnie Lee's uncles were teenage boys, then me and my young uncles we use to follow them when grandmama leave home, we didn't go with her, she used to tell us to stay in that yard and don't leave home and soon as she get out of sight, we go down aunt Emma's house and get with boys and all day long hunting rabbits, we don't be in school, we be hunting rabbits.

Larry Rivers: So, that was a form of fun?
Arnett Goins Um, hum, and we hunt rabbits, sometime when we get back home, grandmama be done came from work and we scared to go in the house cause we gonna get a whopping, cause we left home. Sometimes she would be to tired to whop us, so she might put that off, and sometimes when she do take that notion, to whop us we might have three whopping stacked up on top of one another.

Larry Rivers: I understand you played a little baseball, can you tell me about that?
Arnett Goins Yeah, I played a little baseball, I played of with St. Petersburg, I didn't play in the Negro league, but, I played against the Negro league.

Larry Rivers: Hum, tell me a little about that!
Arnett Goins I played ball against the Homestead League, the Kansas City Monarchs, Newark Eagles, Indianapolis Clowns, Chicago American Gaints, Homestead Braves, we played all those teams. Atlanta Black Crackers - they weren't in the league, but we played against them, Birmingham; Birmingham had a black team, we played against them.

Larry Rivers: Tell me now, you said you played against the Negro League, what league were you a part of , was it all mixed league?
Arnett Goins No, it wasn't no mixed league it was all Negroes, It ain't but one time one Jew boy played ball, he was living in St. Petersburg too. He was a pitcher, he use to come and work out with us. Some of the white boys, two of them I know that went to the major leagues use to come out and practice with us.

Larry Rivers: Where did you develop this excellent ability to play baseball, What position did you play?
Arnett Goins Pitcher, when I wasn't pitching I was playing outfield.

Larry Rivers: When did you develop this affinity, this desire to play baseball did it go all the way back to Rosewood day's?
Arnett Goins Yeah my uncle, he was, when I started playing baseball, I must have been about 15-16 years old. My uncle learned me how to curve balls and when I started playing ball, I was pitching and getting them out to.

Larry Rivers: I understand, that you were a very good baseball pitcher and I think that is gonna be another story that I'm going to pursue, if no one else does.

Larry Rivers: Who was Statual Page?
Arnett Goins Who was Statual Page, that was of, he was old when he went to the majors, he was gosh, 50 years old, he was a great pitcher, when you got so you could hit Statual Page, you were ready for the majors.

Larry Rivers: If they had allowed Blacks to play in the major leagues, Statual Page would have made it as young man, he was always good.
Arnett Goins Oh yeah, he was good. He was one of the greatest.

Larry Rivers: Now tell me, did Minny Lee's cousin play baseball?
Arnett Goins Now yea, one of them did, Oscar. Me and Oscar played ball right there in St. Petersburg together. I played ball with my uncle right there in Lacoochee. We played ball together.

Larry Rivers: Now, who is Minnie Lee?
Arnett Goins Minnie Lee is of, my grandfather and Minnie Lee grandfather are brothers. They are brothers, and me an Minnie Lee use to play and wrestle, she is just like a Tom boy, we use to wrestle and tussle, when we were kids.

Larry Rivers: So you all played as children?
Arnett Goins Urn hum, Oh yeah!

Larry Rivers: Tell me a little bit about as you recall the incident and where it started on Jan. 1, 1923. Just give me your recollection, just take your time and kind of walk us through as you remember it and if there is a point where I want to interrupt you about certain things, please forgive me, because if I don't I may for get it But tell me a little bit about it as you recall.
Arnett Goins Well, this lady Fannie Taylor, my grandmother worked for her, we use to go with my grandmother.

Larry Rivers: So that's Mrs Carrier?
Arnett Goins Yeah, Mrs Sara Carrier, that's my grandmother on my mama side. She was working for this lady, and we had went home for Christinas, cause, they didn't allow my daddy to work on those logs and we would be one place on the other Christmas time. We always go to Rosewood and spend the Christmas, up there with my grandparents. So this particular time, my mother left she take the baby with her, my youngest sister she was the baby and she left me, and my sister and my brother, my baby brother, left us there with grandmama. So during the time, this was happening, grandmama went to work and my sister went with her, my sister, I think she was 22 months or almost two years old. She went to work with grandmama, and when this happen, we were playing, playing out in the yard, out in front of the house, we were right side the railroad, it was right in front where we lived at. What had happen .. my sister.

Larry Rivers: Your oldest sister, what's her name?
Arnett Goins Philomena Doctor

Larry Rivers: Okay Philomena Doctor, okay I'm sorry go ahead.
Arnett Goins My sister said, and I wasn't there cause I was home at the house, my sister said a man came out the house was a white man stepped cross the fence. But I guess he was must of something to this lady, cause he had beat her up.

Larry Rivers: Okay who was this white man, was he her husband?
Arnett Goins No, he wasn't her husband, he must was her boyfriend or something. No he was none of her husband, but anyway,when her husband come home she just say, she was attacked by a black man, which is was a white guy, my sister say it was a white man that come out of that house.

Larry Rivers: How did she describe the attack, did she say she was attacked and raped or just simply attacked?
Arnett Goins She was attacked. I don't think she said she was raped, I think he just whopped her.

Larry Rivers: So, she was just bruised?

Larry Rivers: How did Jessie Hunter get to be the suspect of this attack of Mrs. Fannie Taylor? You probably heard that Jessie Hunter was a black escape convict?
Arnett Goins I don't know nothing about it, they said it was a black escape convict they say, but what so ever had happened, they had bloodhounds. They must have got them for the rape from one of the camps and the blood hound tracked, caused we came out in the yard when the blood hounds track the person from Sumner to Rosewood and they tracked him to Minnie Lee's house.

Larry Rivers: Who is Minnie Lee's Uncle?
Arnett Goins His name was Aaron Carrier and so they ah tracked him in the house and track him to the fence and that's where the dog could track him they say.

Larry Rivers: They tracked him to the fence?
Arnett Goins When the dogs tracked him to the fence they couldn't track him no futher. So they were gonna ask Aaron Who was the man, now so this what was told to me. So they asked Aaron who was the man, Aaron didn't tell. So he just told them Sammy had carried him off in his wagon and asked another black man. I don't think they took to much off him, because he didn't take no stuff off white people.

Larry Rivers: So they didn't care too much for Sam Carter in the beginning because Sam Carter was a man of humanity who stood up for his rights.
Arnett Goins So, they asked Sam Carter did he recognize? Sam Carter wouldn't tellem so I don't know whether the white guy was a Mason or Sam Carter was a Mason. You know they always kind of stick together right up - there the Masons. So, he wouldn't tellem, so they say if you don't tell them, we gonna kill you, he say well you can kill me, but he said you can't eat me! So they hungem up, they killed him and shot holes in him, but, I didn't see em dead, but my grandmama would never let me go see nothing like that, but they killed him and then sent word to my grandmama, and Sylvester Carrier, my mother was next to him the house; going back they sent word by grandmama to tell Sylvester, which was her oldest kid, that my uncle, my mother was next, he act like he didn't cared. Why did they decide to say Sylvester Carrier was next after the death of Sam Carter? Cause, they didn't like him, they didn't like him. Tell me about Sylvester Carrier! Sylvester Carrier was a guy he went about his business, he didn't bother nobody, he didn't want nobody bothering with him, and he had I or 2 teenage young aunts. Be didn't like for those girls to going walking to Rosewood, walking up the road to Sumner which was 3 miles from there to Wylly which was 1 mile, the white guys you know like to throw WOLF cracks at girls you know and so everybody know everybody long through then, and at their age they have to know everybody. So when they get back home, cleve say, they called Mannie. Mannie sis & sis person said sis and sis thing. He say what? Sis S sis person said sis & sis to me! Say he did? Yeap, he didn't wait to tomorrow or a week later to see this person, he gets right up and he gets right up and he will go to who and so ever said it, he go right to their house & tell em Walk right into their yard and tell em.

Larry Rivers: Would he only do this to a black man, that said something or talked out of line to his daughters or sisters or relatives or just who would he say these things to?
Arnett Goins It mostly be whites, he will go and tell em, he say my sister said you said sis & sis a thing to her, I he said, you know I don't mess with your people and I don't want you messing with my sisters, he would say that ah, if you do it again, you gonna have to deal with me, and would turn around and walk out of their yard. They didn't like him for that, and that's the only reason I figure that they told grandmama to tell Sylvester he was next if he stayed in Rosewood. Well, he could have left, he could have left Rosewood and ah but ah he didn't, he told grandmama, see, I call my grandmama mama and call my mama sister, but I called my grandmama. mama, and my grandpapa papa, he told mama say ah of let him come on, he say I was born and raised here in Rosewood, he say I'm not going no where he say let em come on.

Larry Rivers: Did they eventually come to Carrier House?
Arnett Goins Yes, they came,

Larry Rivers: Did Mrs. Sara Carrier recognize some of the whites out there yelling at Sylvester?
Arnett Goins I don't whether she could recognize them or not, but they called, they asked they begged her to come out, hey begged her to come out. She didn't go out, they just start shooting in her house shooting all the pots and ah.

Larry Rivers: Was she killed in the house?
Arnett Goins Yes, she was killed right in the room, my aunt one of my youngest aunt was with her, the baby girl was in Gainesville in school.

Larry Rivers: Were you there in the house?
Arnett Goins I was in the house, Minnie Lee was to , me and Minnie Lee both. All of Minnie Lee family was down to my grandparent's house.

Larry Rivers: What happen to Mr. Andrews and Mr. Wilkerson when the shooting started, and they crashed the front door?
Arnett Goins They crash, bust, they knock that front door open and that's far as it got.

Larry Rivers: When they busted the front door down, what happen?
Arnett Goins You couldn't tell them by nothing but their stomach.

Larry Rivers: Who shot them as they came into the house:
Arnett Goins Sylvester.

Larry Rivers: How many people in the house could use guns to ward off the whites from the outside?
Arnett Goins Wasn't nobody in there shooting, wasn't nobody in there shooting, but Sylvester, there was some men had enough to shoot cause it was some teenage boys, I guess so teenage boys, I guess some of them was grown.

Larry Rivers: But, Sylvester was the one doing the shooting?
Arnett Goins He was the one doing the shooting.

Larry Rivers: After Polly Wilkerson and Henry Andrews were killed, did that group stop or did they leave and come back?
Arnett Goins They came, they ah, I guess, I don't know how many, you might probably would some more of em, and they, I guess they got fraid and they left.

Larry Rivers: How many children Mr Goins, do you recall were in the house at the time of the shooting?
Arnett Goins Well, let me see now, me, my sister and me.

Larry Rivers: You said you and your sister's uncle, can you give me their names?
Arnett Goins It was Philomena Doctor, Harry Carrier, Carrier, Aunt Eddie Goins, George Goins Jr, that was my brother, and then ah there was Minnie Lee, and there was Wade, ah Eddie that was there uncle Julius children now.

Larry Rivers: Now, Wade and Eddie what's their last name?
Arnett Goins Carrier, these were Carriers, Wade and Eddie and ah see they were Aaron brothers then there were long which we always call him Hill, and Minnie Lee brother was ah Reubin and ah Minnie Lee youngest uncle was name Jason. See Uncle Gene had six boys and ah one girl. There weren't but 2 girls, that was Minnie Lee and Minnie Lee youngest aunt, the other, Uncle Julius other 2 daughters they weren't there, but all them was there in the house and my uncle's wife, she dare to go out, they let her come out, I haven't seen her since.

Larry Rivers: Now once the shooting died down, the Whites left, what happen in the house then, when the whites left?
Arnett Goins When everything quieten down there, that's when Minnie Lee uncles and brothers, they were teenage boys, they led us off out from the house, they led us from the house and see that anybody, we the older boys, the teenager knowed those woods round about so, they led us away, so we went out and stayed in the woods, about I think it was 2 nights or 3 nights, we stayed in the woods. It was cold, it was in January and ah these got words to us, to be up to Wylly the train, gonna pick us up, and so we got to be in Wylly, so sure enough, the train pick us up coming from Cedar Key and took us, we went ah to Gainseville cause my daddy had, my daddy had ah 2 sisters and a brother in Gainesville, Uncle Reel, Aunt Becky and Aunt Agnes. They were staying and living in Gainsville. That's where we went when my mama come got us.

Larry Rivers: Now, what happened to your grandmother?
Arnett Goins Grandmother got killed. They just start shooting through the blinds, they had these shutters to protect the window panes, and they just start shooting and ah my Aunt the one what teach school she was in the room with grandmama and ah, she knew she had gotten hit, when she got hit, so she lied down across the bed and she made her way on upstairs where we were at.

Larry Rivers: How long did you and the other children stay in the woods until the train came to Wylly, to take you to Gainesville?
Arnett Goins We were about, I think we stayed 2 nights in the woods, I believe it was 2 nights or 3 nights. I believe it was 2 nights except the night, it might have been 3 nights.

Larry Rivers: When did you actually go into the woods? Was it the second day after all the shooting started?
Arnett Goins Nail, right after the shooting stop, right after the shooting stopped.

Larry Rivers: So, it was right after the Whites left, as if they had the intention of coming back, that gave you and your relatives an opportunity to go into the woods to try and hide out until you?
Arnett Goins Yeah, ah-hum.

Larry Rivers: Did you have any clothes, or did you take anything? Did you have any time to take food?
Arnett Goins We ain't have time to take nothing, we just got out of the house!

Larry Rivers: Who do you think sent for the train to come to Wylly?
Arnett Goins I don't know, it must've been somebody, 1 don't know, l really don't know who that was. I don't know it was, but.

Larry Rivers: Had word gotten to the families out in the woods that a train would be coming?
Arnett Goins Oh yeah, ah-hum. Somebody from Wylly told us to be there, that they had gotten words for us to be there up at the train at Wylly, the train would pick us up.

Larry Rivers: Did men board the train once it got there, or whether it was just basically women and children boarding the train from Wylly going to Gainesville?
Arnett Goins Now well, I tell you the truth, I don't know whether it was any men or not, no more than, but those in that house I know of. Now little Ruth em, they might of, well they didn't get on where 1 got on at on the train know how, cause 2, we got on the train at Wylly me and Minnie Lee em, we got on the train at Wylly me and Minnie Lee em, we got on the train at Wylly, Cause that's one mile from Rosewood.

Pause: Okay, let's take a break, just a second!

Statement: Now we are starting again, Mr. Goins, I really appreciate you interviewing with me.

Larry Rivers: What did the people, the women and children who escaped to the woods, what did they eat?
Arnett Goins Well, we had some ah, some people in Wylly, they didn't, I think they had some people to eat pretty close to us, but you know, they deliver there to Wylly at the turpentine still. They passed something out there.

Larry Rivers: So people brought you food from Wylly to the woods, so you all didn't starve!
Arnett Goins We didn't starve!

Larry Rivers: These people, were they White who brought you the food, or were they Blacks who brought you the food?
Arnett Goins They were black.

Larry Rivers: Blacks from Wylly?
Arnett Goins Yeah.

Larry Rivers: When the whites from Cedar Key and Sumner found out that there were blacks in the woods, did they get mad with the people in Wylly, was there any kind of rukus in Wylly and Rosewood?
Arnett Goins I don't know, I really don't know.

Larry Rivers: Now, where did most of the survivors finally settle after Rosewood, I know that they boarded the train in Wylly for Gainesville, did most of them as far as you can recall stay in Gainesville after the 1923 incident or did they go other places?
Arnett Goins They was all around, some in New Smyrna, some in Miami, some in Pensacola, Jacksonville and ah Lacooche, but I was all over Taylor County just about it, my daddy got that kind of work, my daddy did work in the swamp.

Larry Rivers: Your daddy worked in the swamp?
Arnett Goins Yeah.

Larry Rivers: Was he a hunter?
Arnett Goins Nail, he was logging, you know getting the log and stuff out?

Larry Rivers: Now, what happen Mr. Goins to Sylvester Carrier, now I know the women and children escaped to the woods, but in the mean - time, after they had gotten into the woods, the group of Whites returned to the house again, and I understand that Sylvester Carrier was still in the use, and he shot back. What ultimately happened to Sylvester Carrier that you can recall?
Arnett Goins Yeah, I haven't seen my uncle, but I really don't believe they killed him, they say they claimed they wound him that night, and went back the next day to finish him off, but I don't believe that, cause we had our aunt, one of my mama sisters was ah living down in Kelsey City on the east coast, a man came and told her, it was a guy up there wanted to see her, but he didn't, she asked him who was it, but he didn't know who he was, he didn't tell her the name, so she wouldn't go to see who it was, then he went back and told him, she wouldn't come, he say okay then he say well tell her , I was his brother, tell her brother, I am going on. That was in the east coast, that must've been round about, been 26, that might have been 26, cause, my brother was with aunt Bevlah down there then, might have been that so, she figure that was Sylvester , but ah later on when my aunt died, the woman next to my mama she died in 58, no that wasn't 58, aunt Beulah died somewhere in the 60's and ah, my cousin Minnie Lee uncle they came to the funeral, and they told us, said want some of yall go over there and ah get that house that Sylvester left over there, out there from Palatka, out from Branon some where out there, and she say a guy told me say he say I know Sylvester cause me and him came up in the cradle together, say he died and ain't nobody never came out there to claim that property. So, I don't know and I was just like they say they claimed they killed my youngest uncle, the one me and him use to go in the woods with Minnie Lee Uncles and they claimed he stood up on his mama's grave and shot him down and he got killed died in New York just about forty years later, so I just don't know how he died then.

Larry Rivers: How many people do you think after everything was over in Rosewood for 4 or 5 days, actually were killed? For example, lets back up to the time whites came initally, and killed Ms. Sarah Carrier, and then when they push in the door, and when Poly Wilkerson and Henry Andrews were killed. How many you remember lying out in the yard that had been killed? No, I don't know, I couldn't tell you.

Larry Rivers: Would you say that, some were out there?
Arnett Goins I would say that there were some out there, I believe there were some out there cause my uncle he could maneuver around in the house, they was on the outside, he could maneuver around in the house and he could shoot outside. I don't know how many was killed.

Larry Rivers: But you remember some were killed, and they were Just lying around on the ground outside the house?
Arnett Goins I don't remember stepping over nothing, but I did remember stepping over those two in the hallway.

Larry Rivers: So, you remember stepping over two in the hallway?
Arnett Goins Wilkerson and Henry Anderson.

Larry Rivers: But, you don't remember maybe seeing other bodies out in the yard, no that's not a problem, you just don't remember, if you don't remember seeing them that's fine.
Arnett Goins Not really cause we were trying to get away from there, but I learnt you could find them by the buzzard I learnt, I heard people say you could find them by the buzzard, I don't know whether they were black or white.

Larry Rivers: How many do you think, from what you remember were killed altogether, How many blacks?
Arnett Goins I don't know, right now, I'll tell you the truth, I don't know but one that was my grandmama my grandpapa brother he was killed, Sammy Carter they lynch him, they hung him up and shot him.

Larry Rivers: Now you said your grandmother right. Now who was the second one?
Arnett Goins Was uncle Gene, that was my grandpapa brother, he was a Carrier.

Larry Rivers: Gene Carrier right?
Arnett Goins Ah-hum, they say they made him dig his grave and shot him down.

Larry Rivers: Did you remember Sam Carter?
Arnett Goins Yes that's the one they lynch.

Larry Rivers: So you remember about three blacks that were killed?
Arnett Goins Yes, that's all the ones I can give in account of.

Larry Rivers: The two whites you can remember were killed were Polly Wilkerson and Henry Andrews, the Sheriff and the Deputy Sheriff.

Larry Rivers: What do you remember about the Ingram family, It was a family that lived in Rosewood.
Arnett Goins You know, I was always wondering, because it used to be, we stay on one side of the railroad and there was a big two story building right direct across in front of us and white people lived there and I don't know whether those was Ingram or I just don't remember, whether they were Ingram or not.

Larry Rivers: What kind of person do you beleive Sheriff Robert Walker was he the sheriff in the area of Rosewood? How was the Sheriff around in the area of Rosewood, do you remember Sheriff Walker?
Arnett Goins I don't know whether, he was a Sheriff or not he wasn't in Rosewood, you talking about a guy name Bob Walker, ah yeah, he was at Gulf Hammock, that was in union county too, yeah 60 miles from all creek, he was ah well, now I heard he was, he had told somebody his son was had ah Sylvester gun, so I don't know cause, my uncle had a heap of guns, plenty guns and ah Bob Walker, he was no Sheriff, he was a Quarter boss, cause in Gulf Hammock they had seven Quarters. So every time you go from one quarter to the other, you had to cross, a bridge in order to get to, and he was Quarters to Gulf Hammock. The only white guy went down in there, he didn't allow any other white people down there, he would say, what you doing down there! If they gave him any back talk, he would go up right up side their head and say get from down here, you ain't got no business down here, don't come down here no more, because it was nothing down here but negroes.

Larry Rivers: Was there a such thing as the Goins Quarters?
Arnett Goins Yeah ah-hum, they had Goins, my grandaddy had a turpentine still and he had a bunch of houses, I've seen the houses when I was, but I can't remember mygrandpa or my grandmama, not on my daddy's side.

Larry Rivers: Did many Blacks in Rosewood own their own land or did the Goins family lease land?
Arnett Goins Nail, I don't know, but he had a turpentine still, I don't know when he had lease it or whether he had bought it, I don't know, but I know the turpentine sill, after it died out, he wasn't running that any more, but he had little houses, he called the Goins Qarters, I think my cousin that's he now lived down in these houses, but I always liveded up there with my grandparents.

Larry Rivers: Would you consider Mr. Goins who owned the turpentine still to have a pretty big operation?
Arnett Goins I don't know, cause it wasn't operating when I could remember, I know it was a turpentine still, my aunt used to tell me say, I looked just like my grandaddy, I don't know whether it was operating or not, but I know the one only turpentine still, I knowed was operating was in Wylly that was one mile from here.

Larry Rivers: In 1923, how many blacks do you think lived in Rosewood? How many families and how many total black families? Was it more than 100-200 was most of them related?
Arnett Goins Over 200 with the children. Most of the family's was Carriers, Goins, Colemans, Evans, Bradleys, Edwards.

Larry Rivers: Were all of these families through marriage?
Arnett Goins Yes.

Larry Rivers: Of the families did most own their own land?
Arnett Goins I don't know anything about that land owning, I was to young to know about all of that.

Larry Rivers: Do you remember a family by the name of Pillsbury?
Arnett Goins No, I can't remember the Pillsbury.

Conclusion: Dr. Rivers: I think we have covered most of the questions I wanted to ask you Mr. Goins, I really appreciate you taking time to talk to me about the Rosewood incident. I know it's a situation that you will never ever forget. I'm happy we had the opportunity to talk. One thing I am going to do is to make sure that this tape is available in the Black Archives so that students from Tugaloo and students from other colleges will never forget the Rosewood incident, and that it should become a part of the history of Florida. If we are to tell the total story, the total history of Florida, we must include the Rosewood incident and you have helped to make that possible, and I thank you very much.

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